Fukushima - The US populace has moved on/doesn't care
I follow every day the monster thread at AboveTopSecret and it is clearly documented in that thread that there is a conspiracy going on with what's happening at Fukushima. It is also clearly documented
that the situation going on is much worse that we are being told.
Also, there are reports of plutonium being found on the West Coast via a "hidden" SQL statement on the EPA website, Iodine at 2000%+ of EPA guidelines in California Milk, EPA Radnet "conveniently" being down, Canada moving their radiation monitoring station further inland (can't find link, saw it on monster thread)... it begins to paint a "concerning" picture.
I have children, and, as a father, am understandably concerned about Fukushima as it might have long-lasting effects on THEIR future. As such, I try and take salient facts from the monster thread, research them more and make people aware.
This is where the problem occurs. Everyone that I try and make aware is switching off. I'm not fear-mongering when I speak to them, I'm not sensationalizing when I speak to them.... all I'm doing is relaying cold, hard facts (as much as we have)...
Within the last 2 days, I've been called a "Debbie Downer", been told that I'm misinformed as surely we would have heard about it on the news, called paranoid or just out-right ignored. I've been in contact with my local water company and received "nothing to see here, move on" response. I've contacted my state senator (who normally is VERY responsive to me, I know him personally) about starting some sort of monitoring, at the least, on our milk being sold in stores... NO RESPONSE.
Everyone is sticking their heads in the sand or just don't care. They've moved on to the birth certificate issue, the royal wedding event, the Libyan war or whatever comes next that the MSM decides to entertain us with. Even this forum is slowing down, the updates are quite as close together as they have been... are people HERE starting to have Fukushima Fatigue?
What has been everyone else's experience when talking about this with other daily Americans? Is there anything we can do to make people aware, or should I just stop caring as well and go watch American Idol?
I am experiencing the same
I am experiencing the same thing. When I try to share information and facts with my family, friends and neighbors get the same reaction and have been called 'alarmist'. When I ask them why they don't care since it's one of the biggest disasters in history that we will all be paying for with our lives for decades to come, the reply is that there is nothing they can do about it or really?, and they are notinterested in carrying on the conversation. Therefore, I have decided to focus my energy on protecting myself and my family by stocking up on seaweed, sprullina, chollera, kelp, flour, beans and lots of rice, tea and other items that were packaged pre Fukushima. I refuse to waste my time on ignorant, uninformed people who easily dismiss my help as 'alarmist'.
Not apathetic
Well, I just got back from the organic food store, and although I'm now highly wary...I brought home carrots from California. I will no longer buy Brown Cow yoghurt...they are CA. I am extremely wary because I have serious health problems. Once I have used up my last bit of fish oil capsules, I will chage over to flax. This is sad for me, because fish oil helps with pain and brain/cognitive stuff. I don't take Fukushima lightly. Cherynobl was a big enough catastrophe that Western Europe tested and tested their food stuffs after that. How worried am I about those carrots I brought home? Hard to say.
RE:American Complacency?
I think the general 'American Complacency' is largely borne of adults who are so preoccupied and chronically exhausted by the daily grind of 40+ work weeks that they just do not have the time to accord appropriate attention and energy to vital issues such as this along with political, local and civic matters.
Nuclear Power is here to stay as dchivers so factually stated. It's true, but what I would like to see is some way that nuclear plants could be designed such that absolutely '0' emission of radioisotopes occurs at any point in their operational life or shut down. When I found out relatively recently that ALL plants in operation do so well then, what that means is the map identifying nuclear power plants at www.greenpeace.org for the greatest concentration in the USA from the midwest to the eastern seaboard implies that ALL of the agricultural lands of the USA receive a certain quantity of nuclear material and since we all eat foods grown throughout the USA, anything from grain based foods to produce, dairy and meat products we are all 'contaminated' and this pretty clearly explains why so many ads, including the hard copy insert from a local well known hospital here in Reno, NV where we live is all about CANCER. Also, now I THINK I know why the BRAWM team has stated that they are absolutely NOT CHANGING THEIR DIET DURING THIS TIME!
Meantime, since the whole world has been (since 1945) and will sontinue to be 'soiled' by nuclear fallout in air, land and sea your best options involve minimizing exposure by engaging in ongoing self education and self checking of yourself, your significant others and those in your family.
For guidelines, check out my earlier post also mentioned below my quote conerning seafood: http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/node/3486
'BRAWM Info., Common Sense, Medical Awareness and Staying Informed...
~Off my menu: All Seafoods because the oceans really are a military and industrial sewer! Yes, I will miss Anchovies on my pizza, fishsticks, red snapper, tuna (even 'chicken of the sea' is no longer 'worthy,'crab, fake crab (made with Pollock, an ocean fish), clam chowder, Nori Seaweed,Caviar etc... See: http://pstuph.wordpress.com/2011/04/01/can-ocean-currents-transport-radi...
http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/node/3486
BRAWM Info., Common Sense, Medical Awareness and Staying Informed...
Some good points,
Some good points, HotCaviar
Almost unbelievable to me how anyone can support these nuclear plants which release these long-lasting carcinogens into the environment ... EVEN DURING NORMAL OPERATIONS.
I (unfortunately) live and work about ten miles from the hell-hole known as Three Mile Island. There are two major cancer centers in this area. I'd be a very welthy man if I had a dime for each time that I heard about a fund raiser for some form of cancer on a local radio station.
And it seems like 99% of the "sheeple" here couldn't care less about TMI...
americans have zero
americans have zero attention span and even less of a memory. the bp disaster is ancient history to most. all they care about is $4 gas.
a couple of thoughts....
I think it's unfair to say that the populace doesn't care. The populace has been led to believe that this is a non-issue, so they aren't going to listen to what you have to say, even if it's valid. Again, it's hard to be reasonable when so many of the more extreme websites have taken this to extremes.
For those that are very aware of the risk, some are trying to do something about it in the ways they can (Gundersen and crew), while others are downplaying it for either control issues (think government) or monetary issues (think all the industries that rely on and promote nuclear power).
Also, I find some false sense of security in those that say, take solace in the numbers from the BRAWM team. Although low levels are definitely definitely definitely better than high levels of radiation, from looking at some of the other studies, and what some epidemiologists have to say....low levels of radiation do not necessarily mean less cancer, only more spread out cancers so that they can't be traced very well. Individual probability of cancer goes down, but there is still the positive probability, and even low level increases, I believe, will increase that risk, particularly when you consider that we are already exposed to so many cancer causing things.
This situation will continue, for a very long time. When TEPCO announced that they had "a plan", most folks seemed to step back and give them the benefit of the doubt, I think mostly hoping that it was true, while secretly not having any faith in their words. For those that had faith, I have to wonder what happened to critical thinking....I was hoping that they would come up with something, yet not believing they would.
I don't know at what point folks that are concerned with this will "accept it" and move on. I'm sure some will, others won't be able to....
This situation
Requires required hundreds of tests on milk,produce,soil,water,rain.fallout is localized in effect. brawn team is doing good work but it is so far from comprehensive and not many details go with there tests very unscientific in nature if the same dairys milk is tested then they should state second sample testedfrom farm A ect.same goes for produce ect.
The government is treating this like a level 4 when we are at a level seven I understand brawm air readings are on decline but can the same be said for 8 km in jet stream yes it's still there and will continue to circle globe for years ...
Some people just have a hard time with complex things and this disaster requires critical thinking and research which takes time and energy which no one has.
In Greek mythology,
In Greek mythology, Cassandra (Greek ?????????, also ????????, ????????, ????????,[1] also known as Alexandra[2]) was the daughter of King Priam and Queen Hecuba of Troy. Her beauty caused Apollo to grant her the gift of prophecy. In an alternative version, she spent a night at Apollo's temple, at which time the temple snakes licked her ears clean so that she was able to hear the future (this is a recurring theme in Greek mythology, though sometimes it brings an ability to understand the language of animals rather than an ability to know the future).[3] However, when she did not return his love, Apollo placed a curse on her so that no one would ever believe her predictions. She is a figure both of the epic tradition and of tragedy, where her combination of deep understanding and powerlessness exemplify the tragic condition of humankind.
- It's amazing how thoroughly Greek mythology explores the human condition
Cassandra
A very timely, evocative analogy.
Thank you.
US Populace has moved on...reply
Yes, I agree. You are right to be concerned and it is unfortunate that only extreme conspiracy web sites are giving some facts, if you notice people like Chris Busby's statements showed up on these sites. We all know he is credible and is telling us like it is. Somehow he gets dismissed because the only news media that will invite him into forums are the conspiracy sites. I would pay very close attention to what sources you can find, cause your not going to find it in Main Stream Media. You should keep finding the sources, then check the background credibility of the source. I trust Busby, the guy could be retired, he has something like 7 children and 11 grandchildren yet he is still out there for us, doing battle with the behemoth. I doubt he would steer us in the wrong direction. Also who will take his place when he retires ?
We are in the same club!
To the person whose comment appears right above this, please know that you are not alone. I believe that many of us find ourselves in your position.
I have never thought of myself as some crackpot, but I have to say that it appears that I am now regarded that way by family, friends and most people I speak with about this. I don't send a lot of crazy emails to them, but I believe that the few I do send are probably being deleted like some unwanted spam! And that includes emails detailing info from official sources that admits that there is a meltdown going on! A nuclear meltdown!!
I mean, if THAT doesn't encourage someone to seriously consider what is going on, then I don't know what it could possibly take!
Believe me, this hurts my feelings and injures my considerable pride, BUT most importantly, I find it absolutely alarming. Two relatives actually even told me not to worry, just be happy.
These are people I know--smart, well educated people. If THEY can pooh-pooh this...where does that leave us ("us" being the population of the world)!
So, try and develop a tough skin. The reality of this situation will EVENTUALLY become apparent, I believe. Based upon the degeneration of this crisis and the internet, how can it not?
Even an ostrich eventually pulls its head out of the sand.
Clarification
Obviously, I did not mean to imply that I send crazy emails...just that the emails I do send are probably being deleted.
However, I think that the original implication IS sort of funny in context...
but, you know what I mean.
Old and covered news
The levels in milk have been covered in this forum as well as joint EPA/FDA statements. If you don't believe them, then there's nothing anyone can say that will ease your concerns. But, here's what they say in a nut shell:
1. The EPA does NOT set limits for milk. The FDA does. And the 2600% number in the AboveTopSecret site is referring to the 3 pCi/L EPA limit for *drinking water*. And is a limit intended for if you were going to continuously drink the water over a 70 year lifetime.
2. The FDA DIL (Derived Intervention Level) for milk is 170 Bq/L or approx. 4600 pCi/L. That is intended for a 1 year consumption period. The DIL's were set to respond to a nuclear accident, in which the FDA assumes contamination for a relatively short period of time (up to 1 year). NOT for a lifetime as with the EPA drinking water limits.
From what we are seeing in the BRAWM reports (which they actually reference in the AboveTopSecret site), the levels are dropping. Which is the scenario the FDA built their DIL's around.
Also, the EPA did not detect Plutonium
Another claim that the OP linked to has been debunked on this forum. That was not "hidden" information; it was misinterpreted raw data. The data actually set very good upper limits on how much plutonium could be in the air.
Mark [BRAWM Team Member]
Listen to the Brawn reports
Listen to the Brawn reports and try to ignore all of the other fear inducing sites. I understand how you feel as I am a mother of two children and want nothing but the best for them. The Brawn team continues to be an excellent resource for real truthful information so try to just focus on their findings which at this point should bring comfort. Yes, this is a terrible thing that is going on but at this point, our prayers should be with the poor people of Japan. Through all of this, I am learning to just give it to God. I have found much peace in allowing him to take this burden of constant worry out of my hands. I too love to read the "conspiracy" websites because the material can be really interesting and make you think a little harder. But remember that everything we read is not always true no matter how well put the article seems to be. Thanks to the Brawn team for their continued calm and for factual information. We may never find out what is really going on in Fukashima but at least we do know that the Brawn team will bring us info as they get it through the testing they are doing. I find much comfort in that!
Fear
If one milk test brawn makes is enough and a hand full of random tests with no data backing was spinich milk or produce tested at diffrent times from same farms or locations is milk from the same dairy?if that comforts u that is fine that's your right but if u research past fallout events. Concentrations varied 1000% between diffrent dairys.I cannot even get brawn team to test a sample of soil from central valley 50% of us food supply is from here .I respect they are testing but I question the science maybe after finals they will respond to my questions regarding testing and if products are the same in origin as past tests?
Random testing
You can always consult the reports from the many reporting agencies. Many of the states, universities, and the EPA are reporting results for various medium.
The EPA has posted 67 results for milk alone. 2 from S. Calif and 2 from N. Calif. The CDPH has tested milk and reported result. I believe their testing is from San Luis Obispo. The BRAWM team has reported 18 results for milk.
There's only so much testing and analysis that can be done. And I'm sure everyone wants *their* milk, tap water, produce and dirt tested. And some even want the spots on their car tested!!!
The bottom line is that we are seeing the levels come down. Across every agencies reports. ***At this point***. Which is a good thing.
So the EPA did four milk
So the EPA did four milk tests in california am I correct?
Yes, 4 milk tests
Results from Los Angeles, Oakland and San Francisco. Which was among
the 41 tests they did on air, drinking water, milk and precipitation
in Calif. The CDPH also did 4 tests.
It looks like the EPA did 67 milk samples nation wide from 3/21 to 4/24.
In 36 cities across 25 states. I don't know how they tie into the local
testing that's being done or if they use that data at all.
Economic Contribution In
Economic Contribution
In addition to providing one-fifth of our nation’s milk supply, affordable nutrition and food security for millions of families, California dairy families create 443,000 jobs statewide and $63 billion in economic activity.
http://www.realcaliforniamilk.com/farm-life/sustainability/lowest-carbon...
So 64tests for milk but 4tests for ca dairy but we produce 20% of us supply am I missinng something?
67ya that's alot
Have u read this document regarding 1976 milk testing.
http://www.davistownmuseum.org/cbm/RadxMilk.html
Yup were safe
This innocent looking journal article is actually one of the most important publications in the literature of weapons testing fallout studies. The 1976 Chinese atmospheric test took place long after US and Russian weapons testing had been ended by the Test Ban Treaty of 1965. Two important observations can be made about the legacy of the fallout from cold war weapon's testing. Passing plume pulses from stratospheric or tropospheric fallout, which result in hazardous contamination of the food chain, are not brought to the immediate attention of consumers at risk by the government authorities monitoring the situation. In many cases, including that noted below by Simpson, et. al., the data indicating the hazard is not available until months after the plume passage and when published it is usually in obscure journals that are not read by the general public. The second lesson of this important article is the question raised by a single admittedly large and dirty Chinese atmospheric test: what was the projected dose commitment over a period of years from the combined fallout of hundreds of US and Russian weapons tests, which contaminated food supplies, not only in the United States but throughout the world?
http://www.davistownmuseum.org/cbm/RadxMilk.html
This may get me banned if so god bless
Compare the measurements in that article
Am I reading article right? The I-131 concentrations in milk back in 1976
were as high as 880 pCi/L? At least the chart shows that. The graph shows
a peak of over 1100 pCi/L, if I'm looking at it right.
The highest the EPA has meausured currently is 18 pCi/L in Hilo, HI.
The CDPH measured 3.3 pCi/L.
The highest the BRAWM team has measured is 78.3 pCi/L (2.9 Bq/L) in raw
milk. And 30.78 pCi/L (1.14 Bq/L) in pasturized milk.
So a measurement of 880 pCi/L is VERY high.
Brawm
Brawn team my bad.U guys deserve A+ and a science award even if your tests have been random in nature have they been random?
And BTW,
For those who don't want to go to that web site, the BRAWM number they show is the "Raw Milk" number of 2.9 Bq/L. Which is almost 60x below the FDA DIL. A long way from 2600% of "levels of concern".
Be careful with ATS...it
Be careful with ATS...it promotes paranoia and irrationality more than MSM.
I understand your concern
and it's a real concern, especially if Fukushima takes decades to be resolved, as the experts are implying . However , we have to be very careful with some of these websites since they are based on connect-the-dots theory that can make one paralyzed with fear, with the thought that there is a conspiracy to slowly kill us all with radiation induced cancers. Some of these websites suggest that the earthquake was done on purpose in order to depopulate the world, because the World Bank recently announced that the global population is reaching over 7 billion and that there aren't enough resources to support us all. So, supposedly HAARP set off the earthquake in order to depopulate. And then again, you've got this Louren Moret scientist claiming the earthquake was created by the CIA and DOE for London Banks (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htsWup50i3E&feature=youtu.be)... Does this all sound outlandish? To some, yes. Can it be possible? Maybe ... but probably not. It's tough to enjoy your life while thinking there is a select group in control who exists for the sole purpose of destroying the human race in order to have the world for themselves. yet people who believe in the New World Order and Agenda 21 believe nothing but this. bottom line is: think carefully about both sides of each camp before you rush to any conclusions and drive yourself crazy with worry.
Especially if you're a
Especially if you're a father.
paranoia is promoted by the
paranoia is promoted by the hidden info of nuclear lobby...
The lenguage they use is:
"probably" "it could be" "we don´t know" "exposure is very low" "no problem" "a little amount"
They dont want to alarm people but not for good conscience...
They don´t want to give us bad news because it goes aganst their interests.
If information was good then there were not paranoia problems.
Conspiracy Theories
Sometimes the crazy, "paranoid", "tin foil hat" conspiracy is right. It doesn't take a ton of research to find out that some of the conspiracy theories of the past are the facts of today.
http://www.newworldorderreport.com/News/tabid/266/ID/980/33-Conspiracy-T...
Just Google "C.I.A.
Just Google "C.I.A. Atrocities" and look at the list of what has actually happened. If the corporate wealthy and powerful who use the U.S. military as their own personal mercenaries can have SO LITTLE respect for human life -- women and children included -- can anyone here REALLY be surprised that they would eventually turn that lack of humanity towards (even more) Americans...???