Here, let me google that for you.
There was a concern in the last thread about the possibility of cesium ingestion causing damage to the heart so let's back-of-the-envelope this.
So I googled "cesium cardiac" and quickly found, http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/ahc-asc/media/advisories-avis/_2009/2009_153-eng.php
So, ingestion of Cesium Chloride can create heart arrhythmia. Since this is a chemical effect, any isotope of cesium, whether stable or radioactive, will have this effect.
In fact, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11341085 cardiac researchers will deliberately give animals cesium chloride in order to induce heart problems so they can study them. It takes a minimum dose of 1.02 mMol/kg of CsCl to induce tachycardia. This corresponds to 132 milligrams/kg of Cesium.
At 88 Ci/gm x 3.7e10 Bq/Ci you get 429 billion Bq/kg of Cs-137.
So if an 80kg person ingested 34 trillion Bq of Cs-137 it would be enough to give them tachycardia.
Of course, since that would be a TEDE of 636,000 Sv which is 63,600 times a fatal does for acute radiation poisoning they would need to have their heart attack fast before the radiation killed them in about 2 minutes.
So, I think you can stop worrying about arrhythmia. What about damage from radiation at lower levels?
Googling "heart radiation" brings up a number of links to long term heart damage in people who have received radiation therapy for cancer. http://www.ped-onc.org/survivors/cardio.html
This study, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10838837?dopt=Abstract indicates that receiving more than 40 Sv to the heart is a risk factor for developing later problems.
So let's say we want to keep the dose to the heart at < 1 Sv to be really safe. At a TEDE of 1.851e-2 microSv/Bq I would need to ingest 54 million Bq of Cs-137.
So assuming a lifespan of 70 years you should keep your Cs-137 load to less than 2000 Bq per day in order to be reasonable sure of avoiding any potential cardiac problems over your life.
Diemos
Ask these children how much Cesium you have to take in
http://www.google.com/search?q=chernobyl+belarus+children&hl=en&tbo=d&so...
The Diemos Dodge
The Diemos Dodge is not a Dart or a Ram Charger. It is a subject change.
Illustration:
Taping a plastic bag over your face does not directly damage your lung tissue. You die of hypoxia and THEN your lung tissue begins to experience damage from hypoxia. Taking the drop at the GALLOWS similarly does not Directy Damage any lung tissue. The broken neck interrupts heart circulation; while the noose blocks the airway. The guest of honor dies and THEN the lungs deteriorate.
The contention is that a SMALL Amount of Cs-137/134 causes Interruption of Heart Conduction. This will produce heart arrythmias, which May or May NOT result in heart damage and/or death.
The threshold Cs-137/134 dosage for cardiac conduction interference is REPORTEDLY MUCH LOWER than the threshold for direct tissue damage to the heart.
Death is, or may be in some cases a secondary effect, due to reduced heart circulatory output.
That is the POINT which Diemos is trying to divert us from discussing.
And it is NOT working.
No Diemos' point is that
No Diemos' point is that you're entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts. Especially on a scientific blog your facts need to be grounded in actual scientific data.
"The contention is that a SMALL Amount of Cs-137/134 causes Interruption of Heart Conduction."
Whose contention? Based on what? Linky?
"The threshold Cs-137/134 dosage for cardiac conduction interference is REPORTEDLY MUCH LOWER than the threshold for direct tissue damage to the heart. "
Reported by whom? In what Journal? Based on what data? Linky?
I provide links and show my work for all my points.
Diemos
2 POSTS BELOW
Demon,
Odd challenge, since the response is 2 posts below.
http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/forum/218/here-let-me-google-you.2012-12-08#...
Are WE going to play Poluted Peer Process for a couple of ROUNDS? That was So Much Fun in the East Anglia/NASA 'Global Warming Fraud' and 'Data Diddling Marathon'.
Just for context, I am a 'Cooler King' not a Static Climate 'Denier'. The geologic record shows 500 year warming periods followed by cooing periods (Ice Ages) of several thousand years. The Earth is due for an Ice Age, not a Heat Wave, IMHO.
Tee It Up!
Depending on the time scale...
... it appears from this graph http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Vostok_Petit_data.svg that there are longer periods of warming punctuated by rapid cooling periods. I don't claim to know all the theories for this, but my vote would be comets and/or asteroids.
Professor Farnsworth
This is a radiological blog.
This is a radiological blog. Out of respect for our hosts (and since I'm a particle physicist not a climatologist) I'm going to pass. You'll have to find someone else to defend the ramparts of scientific orthodoxy.
As for myself, since I'm not planning on buying any beach front property, I don't care.
Diemos
Calling Dr. Mengele...
... just wanted to see if you had any relevant data on cesium ingestion and child heart arrhythmia. There seems to be a dearth of clinical information on this topic, and, after reading the wiki entry on Brown's Gas, even the available info may be suspect. The question that occurs to me is, how much radiocesium would have to be present (and how much ingested) in a child's heart for its radiation to equal the radiation the heart receives from K40?
BTW, thanks to all who posted in this thread (so far) - it is well worth reading, imho.
Professor Farnsworth
RadioCaesium effects on Cardiac Conduction
Farns:
There are several publications related to Belarus RadioCesium cardiac effects. This appears to be The Sentinel Paper upon the subject. At present, the BRAWM Link appears to be broken, unavailable … or blocked.
http://www.enfants-tchernobyl-belarus.org/doku.php?id=base_documentaire:...
http://www.enfants-tchernobyl-belarus.org/doku.php?id=notre_association
http://www.enfants-tchernobyl-belarus.org/lib/exe/detail.php?id=base_doc...
Enfants of Tchernobyl Belarus
Association Loi 1901 - Résidence "Les Jardins d'Emeraude" 28 B, rue de la République - appt 21 - 22770 LANCIEUX
Bulletin _Actualités_Agenda/Actions_Base documentaire_
Table 1 Frequency of electrocardiographic modifications and radioactive cesium concentration in the organism of children of different groups.
Group Radioactive caesium accumulation in the organism, Bq/kg Frequency of electrocardiographi c alterations, %
1. Gomel 30,32±0,66 72.3
2. Vetka 82,50±7,32 86,8
3. Svetilovichi 91,20±7,68 94,4
4. Grodno 29,74±0,67 66,3
5. Minsk
including
Minsk-1
Minsk-2 14,00±1,46
Professor Youri Bandajevsky, An appraisal
Professor Youri Bandajevsky
An appraisal by Professor Michel Fernex
http://tchernobyl.verites.free.fr/z_angl/Yuri/Fernex_WILPF_Appraisal.htm
(Interview conducted by Mrs Ballantyne of the Woman's International League for Peace and Freedom (WILPF) and by Professor Andreas Nidecker of Physicians for Social Responsibility (PSR)
Following the interview of Professors Ostapenko, Kenigsberg and of Dr.Minenko concerning the scientific value of the work of Professor Youri I. Bandazhevsky, we asked the opinion of Michel Fernex, octor of Medicine, Professor emeritus of Bâle University, Switzerland, and of Mrs Solange Fernex, ex European MP and president of the French section of the Women's International League for Peace and Freedom. (WILPF)
Question: Have you any first hand knowledge of the Institute where Professor Bandazhevsky worked?
Professor Michel Fernex: I visited the Institute of Medicine of Gomel in autumn 1998 and was highly impressed by the level of this Faculty of Medicine. Discussions with lecturers and staff showed the extent of their knowledge with regard to the health consequences of Chernobyl and there was an active participation by the students during their courses.
As a pathologist and histologist having worked in Switzerland, France and Sweden with World Health Organisation grants (WHO) as well as in Senegal, I was in a position to appreciate the remarkable standards of this institute – with active researchers, small groups of assiduous, attentive students and impressive collections.
Professor Bandazhevsky had prepared, for a parliamentary committee, which had arrived from Minsk the day before, a collection of the congenital malformations collected by his Institute over a period of 15 days (following therapeutic abortions or stillbirths). The number of malformations exhibited corresponded to what one might expect over a 12 month period before the Chernobyl incident.
Question: What can you say with regards to the medical work of Bandazhevsky?
Professor Michel Fernex: It is work of exceptional importance. In no way do I share the criticisms formulated by the scientists whom you interviewed. In just a few sentences, it is impossible to give a full account of the numerous studies of Professor Bandazhevsky. I will focus on only one example, in a field in which I myself worked, cardiomyopathy.
treat arrhythmias PRN
Monitor cardiac rhythm and treat arrhythmias as necessary.
Note: (PRN Pro Re Nata - As Circumstances Require)
http://toxnet.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/sis/search/a?dbs+hsdb:@term+@DOCNO+7389
CESIUM, RADIOACTIVE
This record contains information on the radiological aspects of cesium and its compounds. For information on the general toxicity and environmental fate of cesium ions and cesium compounds, refer to the CESIUM COMPOUNDS record. For general toxicological, safety and handling, and environmental information on ionizing radiation emitted from chemical sources including cesium, refer to the IONIZING RADIATION record.
Advanced Treatment. Consider orotracheal or nasotracheal intubation for airway control in the patient who is unconscious or is in severe respiratory distress. Monitor cardiac rhythm and treat arrhythmias as necessary. Start IV administration of 0.9% saline (NS) or lactated Ringer's (LR). For hypotension with signs of hypovolemia, administered fluid cautiously. Watch for signs of fluid overload. Treat seizures with diazepam (Valium) or lorazepam (Ativan). Perform routine advanced life support care as needed. Use proparacaine hydrochloride to assist eye irrigation. /Radiological Threats: Radiological Dispersal Devices or Weapons/
[Currance, P.L. Clements, B., Bronstein, A.C. (Eds).; Emergency Care For Hazardous Materials Exposure. 3Rd edition, Elsevier Mosby, St. Louis, MO 2005, p. 503] **PEER REVIEWED**
The cesium-137 content in various human tissues was examined 6 years after the Chernobyl reactor catastrophe. ...The median of cesium-137 was 20 mBq/mL in mother's milk, 60 mBq/mL in amniotic fluid, 105 mBq/g in umbilical cords, 51 mBq/g in ovarian tumors, and 140 mBq/g in mammary carcinomas. /Cesium-137/
[Czerwenka KF et al; Wien Klin Wochenschr 106 (18): 590-595 (1994)] **PEER REVIEWED** PubMed Abstract
...About 120,000 children, aged 0-10 years at the time of the /Chernobyl/ accident, were examined in two Belarusian centers, two Ukrainian centers and one Russian center. ...Average values were similar from center to center and from year to year, with an overall average of about 50 Bq/kg of cesium-137. /Cesium-137 fallout/
[United Nations Scientific Committee on the Effects of Atomic Radiation UNSCEAR 2000 Report to the General Assembly, with Scientific Annexes: Sources and Effects of Ionizing Radiation, Vol 2: Effects, p.485.] **PEER REVIEWED**
Excellent! Nice use of
Excellent! Nice use of quotes out of context.
http://toxnet.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/sis/search/a?dbs+hsdb:@term+@DOCNO+7389
"Advanced Treatment. Consider orotracheal or nasotracheal intubation for airway control in the patient who is unconscious or is in severe respiratory distress. Monitor cardiac rhythm and treat arrhythmias as necessary. Start IV administration of 0.9% saline (NS) or lactated Ringer's (LR) TKO. For hypotension with signs of hypovolemia, administer fluid cautiously. Watch for signs of fluid overload. Treat seizures with diazepam or lorazepam. Perform routine advanced life support care as needed. Use proparacaine hydrochloride to assist eye irrigation. /Radioactives I, II, and III/
[Currance, P.L. Clements, B., Bronstein, A.C. (Eds).; Emergency Care For Hazardous Materials Exposure. 3Rd edition, Elsevier Mosby, St. Louis, MO 2005, p. 166] **PEER REVIEWED** "
English translation: First aid instructions, if the patient is having trouble breathing intubate and monitor cardiac rhythm. Standard procedure for anyone who is having trouble breathing.
This is not a statement that cesium causes cardiac problems. And two paragraphs down.
"Special Considerations. Most symptoms from radioactive product exposure are delayed; treat other medical or trauma problems according to normal protocols. An accurate history of the exposure is essential to determine risk and proper treatment modalities. The dose of radiation determines the type and clinical course of exposure: 100 rads: GI symptoms (nausea, vomiting, abdominal cramps, diarrhea). Symptom onset within a few hours. 600 rads: Several GI symptoms (necrotic gastroenteritis) may result in dehydration and death within a few days. Several thousand rads: neurological/cardiovascular symptoms (confusion, lethargy, ataxia, seizures, coma, cardiovascular collapse) within minutes to hours. Bone marrow depression, leukopenia, and infections usually follow severe exposures./Radioactives I, II, and III/
[Currance, P.L. Clements, B., Bronstein, A.C. (Eds).; Emergency Care For Hazardous Materials Exposure. 3Rd edition, Elsevier Mosby, St. Louis, MO 2005, p. 167] **PEER REVIEWED**"
Translation: You need about 10 Sv of dose to see cardiovascular effects which is a dose that is going to kill you anyway.
Just like I said.
Diemos
Internal Dose and Cardiac Conduction
The Internal Dosage of Cs-137/134 is a much bigger deal than external Beta Sources.
Cardiac monitoring is required BECAUSE OF cardiac conduction interference.
Heart conduction interference is quite distinct from Radiation Burn and other gross damage to generalize tissue.
The SUBJECT is conduction/blockage/interference of Cs-137/134 cardiac PQRST waves.
Always changing that subject; you scummy piece of lying ratdung.
Cardiac Conduction is mission-critical to continued life.
But in the spirit of, "Here,
But in the spirit of, "Here, let me google that for you."
Here is an actual paper showing heart function changes in rats fed a Cs-137 contaminated diet.
http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs12012-008-9013-3
No arrhythmia but some chemical changes.
Diemos
Medical TERMS have fixed
Medical TERMS have fixed meanings
The Medical TERM Arrythmia has a FIXED definition
In rats exposed to 137Cs arrhythmias included:
−9% ST Segment Shortening
−11% RT segment shortening
Mean blood pressure decreased −10%
Circadian rhythm disappeared.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/arrhythmia
Medical Definition of ARRHYTHMIA: an alteration in rhythm of the heartbeat either in time or force
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/heart-arrhythmias/DS00290
Most people have occasional, irregular heartbeats that may feel like a fluttering or racing heart. However, some heart arrhythmias may cause bothersome — sometimes even life-threatening — signs and symptoms.
…
However, excellent effort at ‘Damage Control’.
Excellent! You demonstrate
Excellent! You demonstrate an important point.
"−9% ST Segment Shortening
−11% RT segment shortening"
You say this is an arrhythmia, the authors say it isn't. So the definition of what is or isn't an arrhythmia depends on exactly where you draw the line. Otherwise everybody would have arrhythmia if you demanded perfect compliance to some ideal waveform.
And now we can see how Bandajevsky can get his 80% arrhythmia rate at all doses and 20% in this control. He just changes the definition of an arrhythmia until he gets the answer he wants.
To use one of your favorite terms "data diddling".
Diemos
The Authors SAID
ECG analysis did not disclose any arrhythmia EXCEPT
ST- and RT-segment shortening (−9% and −11%, respectively, P < 0.05) in rats exposed to 137Cs. Mean blood pressure decreased (−10%, P < 0.05), and its circadian rhythm disappeared.
Well DUH,
That IS WHAT THE AUTHORS SAID.
(EXCEPT)
We shall skip over the mundane step of providing a dictionary DEFINITION for COMMON WORDS, such as 'Except', 'Sex', Alone, & etc. So, parse-on Parson. The right to later provide a Webster definition is retained, should PARSING the word (EXCEPT) be your actual intent.
Right about now
Right about ... now, in response to a little hint.
I expect that a significant number of Fukushima region parents, including: nurses, paramedics, cops, physicians, technicians ... and their friends, have hooked themselves and their kids to readily AVAILABLE heart monitors.
Also, a significant number of EE-Sparkies have figured out that their O-Scope will produce a heart rhythm trace, with a bit of conducting gel and a couple of standard probes and a bit of aluminum foil taped to their kid's chest.
Similarly, it is expected that UPS, DHL and other international shippers are delivering PERSONAL heart monitors to customers in the Fukushima region and throughout Honshu Island. There is probably a slight shortage and backlog, but the information BLACKOUT is already OVER!
The heart conduction question will NOT remain an OPEN question ... for long. Word travels FAST, in my experience. The ladies (moms) will soon be, or already are, chatting about this at the beauty-shops, nail salons and shoe stores, as well as at their places of employment in the hospitals, engineering firms, law offices, bars, restaurants and ...
Time is SHORT ... where it counts.
Outstanding, I'm all in favor
Outstanding, I'm all in favor of more data.
Diemos
Cutting to the Chase
Demon, er um ... Diemos, AKA Rude Dog, or whoever you wish to style yourself.
While definitively demonstrated elsewhere ... this REPEAT is for your ineptly snoogled self.
http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/forum/218/visiting-tokyo-japan-2013-radiatio...
So we 'cut to the chase', for your reading-comprehension-&-retention CHALLENGED self. You apparently one of the 'SPECIAL' people, so what is your best event at the 'Special Olympics'?
You would need to use GRAMS per DAY of Stable Cesium Chloride as a Salt Substitute to EVER have a physiologic effect. RadioCesium Cs-137/134 IS the Culprit in the Chernobyl and Fukushima regions. Likely TMI PA region as well, but that is a different kettle of fish.
2.2 SUMMARY OF HEALTH EFFECTS
Cardiac Arrhythmias
http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp157.pdf
TOXICOLOGICAL PROFILE FOR CESIUM
Information regarding health effects in humans that can be associated with exposure to higher-thannormal levels of stable cesium is restricted to an account of decreased appetite, nausea, and diarrhea in a man who repeatedly ingested experimental amounts of cesium chloride and reports of prolonged QT syndrome and associated cardiac arrhythmias in patients who ingested (MASSIVE QUANTITIES OF) cesium chloride as a component of homeopathic remedies.
Exposure to radioisotopes of cesium is of much greater human health concern. Energy released by radioactive isotopes can result in significant damage to living cells. Both 134Cs and 137Cs emit beta particles and gamma rays, which may ionize molecules within cells penetrated by these emissions and result in tissue damage and disruption of cellular function. The most important exposure routes for radioisotopes of cesium are external exposure to the radiation released by the radioisotopes and ingestion of radioactive cesium-contaminated food sources. Inhalation and dermal exposure routes may also present a health hazard. The hazards of external exposure to 134Cs and 137Cs are similar to those of other gamma- and beta-emitting radionuclides.
3.5.2.3 Dermal Exposure
One report was located regarding distribution of cesium in animals following dermal exposure (Pendic and Milivojevic 1966). The investigators found widespread distribution of 137Cs in rats within a few minutes following application of 137CsCl solution to the skin. Although cesium was distributed throughout the body, it was deposited mainly in the kidneys, muscular tissues (particularly cardiac muscle), and liver.
http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxp
http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp157.pdf
Nice link. It's an excellent resource on the current understanding of toxicity of both stable and radioactive cesium, that's why it agrees with everything I said. After all, I'm a scientist and I base my opinions on the best current scientific information. That's why I keep referring to you as CLUELESS ENGINEER since you are apparently incapable of understanding your own links.
Sec 1.3, "On average, a person swallows about 10 μg of stable cesium per day in food and water,"
2000 Bq/day of Cs-137 is 0.0006 micrograms/day which is a lot less than you're already eating so you wouldn't need to worry about any of the chemical effects of Cs.
(P.S. Farnsworth, that's why the flame test is useless. It'll just pick up the natural non-radioactive Cs in the environment.)
Sec 1.9, "Annual Limits on Intake (ALIs) for on-thejob exposure are 100 μCi (1x102 μCi) for 134Cs and 200 μCi (2x102 μCi) for 137Cs."
200 microCi/year = 7.4 million Bq / year of Cs-137. So the NRC is a little more generous than I am for occupational exposure. They'll let people ingest 20,000 Bq /day versus my 2000 Bq/day recommendation.
Sec 3.6.2, "Cesium is not likely to be of toxic concern to humans exposed to cesium by inhalation, oral, or dermal contact. Although a number of investigators have reported cesium-induced alterations in behavior or cardiac activity in animals systems exposed to cesium chloride by parenteral injection, underlying mechanisms are not yet fully understood."
So, no concerns about the chemical effects of cesium-137 at less than environmental exposures.
Sec 3.6.2, "Cesium was shown to alter normal cardiac rhythm, triggering short-lived early after depolarizations (EADs) and polymorphic ventricular tachyarrhythmias (VTs) in canine myocardial muscle fibers and Purkinje cells (Brachmann et al. 1983; Levine et al. 1985; Murakawa et al. 1997; Patterson et al. 1990), effects that are similar to those observed in humans with congenital and acquired long QT syndrome (Bonatti et al. 1983). Prolonged QT syndrome and associated cardiac arrhythmia have been observed in patients who consumed cesium chloride as a component of homeopathic remedies (Bangh et al. 2001; Harik et al. 2002; Saliba et al. 2001). Available animal data suggest that cesium-induced EADs and VTs were most likely the result of ionic imbalance due to reduced potassium permeability (Isenberg 1976) and imbalances of intra- and extracellular concentrations of calcium and sodium (Szabo et al. 1987)."
So, cesium affects the heart chemically. For potential radiation damage see the documented effects that occur post radiation therapy.
Diemos
Did EWE Blink RudeDog?
Demon, Rude-Dog, DieMOST ... or whatever
So NOW you are a Pscientist (PseudoScientist)? We suppose that you are tired of foolishly masquerading as a PseudoEngineer, PseudoEngProfessor, barOwner, Astronaut and WarHero.
Guess you missed this part, ClumsyBeech.
"Exposure to radioisotopes of cesium is of much greater human health concern. Energy released by radioactive isotopes can result in significant damage to living cells. Both 134Cs and 137Cs emit beta particles and gamma rays, which may ionize molecules within cells penetrated by these emissions and result in tissue damage and disruption of cellular function."
RudeDog, your Mom is calling down the basement stairs. She needs you to hold her knitting yarn.
You better scurry thataway, she might be angry.
RudeDog is the ex-professor
RudeDog is the ex-professor of nuclear engineering (or so he says, I see no reason to doubt him), I'm the mild mannered particle physicist.
"Exposure to radioisotopes of cesium is of much greater human health concern. Energy released by radioactive isotopes can result in significant damage to living cells. Both 134Cs and 137Cs emit beta particles and gamma rays, which may ionize molecules within cells penetrated by these emissions and result in tissue damage and disruption of cellular function."
I agree with this quote entirely. We even know how much dose someone needs to absorb in order to cause noticeable damage. I even went through the calculations for you. You should study them in detail until you understand them.
Diemos
So if I am reading your posts correctly, Diemos,...
HERE http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/forum/218/here-let-me-google-you.2012-12-08#...
you say:
"You need about 10 Sv of dose to see cardiovascular effects which is a dose that is going to kill you anyway."
HERE http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/forum/218/here-let-me-google-you.2012-12-08#...
you say:
"So, no concerns about the chemical effects of cesium-137 at less than environmental exposures."
AND
"So, cesium affects the heart chemically. For potential radiation damage see the documented effects that occur post radiation therapy."
Have you managed to eliminate BOTH radiation and chemical effects of CS137 as possible causes of child heart arrhythmias in Fukushima? Or not?
And as far as flame testing salt substitute for Cs137, would you suggest this as a UCB undergraduate project? Even if you didn't like the result?
Professor Farnsworth
I laid out for you the
I laid out for you the chemical and radiological effects of Cs-137 ingestion that have been scientifically established. The biggest effect, of course, being the increased risk of cancer in later life.
As for childhood heart arrhythmias there's no compelling reason to believe there is any effect. Although, like all good scientists, if compelling data becomes available then I'll believe in it.
"Even if you didn't like the result?" The core of science is to believe the data regardless of whether you like the result or not. Regardless of whether it advances your political agenda or not. Data comes first, belief comes after.
This is ass-backwards to standard human patterns of thought where belief comes first and then any data that contradicts it is rejected and any data that seems to support it is celebrated.
The greatest enemy of the scientist is himself and his own very human urge to see what he wants to see in the data. That's why proper experimental protocols are critical, so that what he wants to see can't affect what he does see.
I already laid out for you why your flame testing is a waste of time. Just buckle down and pay to have a lab do a real test. Then you can put the salt substitute to bed and move on to the next substance you'll be obsessing over.
Diemos
"Pay to have a lab do a real test"???...
... umm, do you have any idea where one could find a lab that could perform such a test? You know, one with a sophisticated germanium detector? Should I look for one that specializes in radiological air and water monitoring? Conveniently located? Perhaps with a web forum? Of course - the Yellow Pages!!
Professor Farnsworth
As you recall (since you
As you recall (since you posted on that thread) OSU was willing to do a scan for the guy concerned about salmon.
http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/forum/218/sockeye-salmon-tested-cesium-134-a...
Get in contact with them.
http://ne.oregonstate.edu/
http://ne.oregonstate.edu/content/gamma-spectroscopy-facilities
Diemos
How about the DHS...
... do they ever get involved with issues of, you know, homeland security? Oh, wait, this would come under Cronyrad, not Terrorad...
Also, you might pass your suggestion on to the salt substitute thread OP - I am not he.
Professor Farnsworth
Hey! I know! Chris Busby has
Hey! I know!
Chris Busby has a detector. Why don't you send your salt substitute to him? I sure he'll be eager to spend day and night testing various salt brands until he unravels the mystery of the salt substitutes. Maybe he can make a video about it!
Diemos